fur prices

[Buckwheat]

I talked to my fur buyer today. He said he is still setting on fur from last year. The early fur market is unknown. Every other year he would tell me what he thinks he will pay the fist week of the season. This year he said it is unknown.
But if he had to guess it will be real low.
Good for us callers but bad for the trapper that is in it for extra cash.

h

[Misterjake23]

I hunt  (call) for the enjoyment and thrill of the sport.  Even if the fur was worthless, I would still be out there.

[Buckwheat]

Jake
I think you will find most callers are not in it for the fur prices.
It us just the thrill of the hunt and enough money for gass it great.

[Misterjake23]

     I had a fox in the field behind my house the other evening.  Just for curiosity sake, I began to lip squeak,simply to see if I could get his attention.......3 minutes later I had the red fox stareing me down at 5 paces away!!

     Talking about something that was cool!!  Imagine if you had a kid with you and that happened, how thrilled the kid would have been.  He would have went to school the next day and told all his friends and teachers about it.

     Heck,   I'm 46 years old and told all my friends about it the next day.....BOTH OF THEM !!!

     It's that thrill and excitement one gets that keeps you going back to the woods.  The thrill of the hunt, Not the chase of the dollar.....

[Hern]

Buckwheat, I think most trappers are not 'in it, for the money' or they would've quit after the fur boom in the late '70's to early 80's.
Most seasoned trappers and predator callers....I can't put into words, the best I can say... it's what the do. It's their lifestyle.
Sorta like a guy possessed with Trout fishing, Duck hunting, Turkey hunting, Golfing and so on.
It's what they do.

And as far as the few guys looking to make a few bucks on fur, they will make adjustments. By that, they will store fur until price justifies their selling. Yes, a few trappers set on fur for a few years. or They will spend more time out-of-state targeting higher price fur that isn't native/available to their state.
It's what they do...

[Buckwheat]

Hern
What I said did kind of throw all trappers in one group. That was not my intent.
I too believe there are many trappers that just enjoy trapping like any other sport.
But money does drive the market and how many will be trapping.
 When I was getting $3 for fox there was no body trapping.
Now most farms have a trapper on them. When the fur prices started climbing to $18 for fox trappers started trapping again. There were at lest 15 years that there was no one in my area taking fur. But before that when prices startef setting price records there was a trapper on every farm like it is now again.

[Hern]

Money does drive the market.
A few short years ago, Grey Fox were selling for $38-$42 average. Reds were selling for $12-$18 at the same time.
Predator Callers came out of the woodwork to call Greys with those high prices.
Coon and Muskrat prices advanced and that put more trappers and Coon hunters in service.
But everyone is doing it for fun.
Coyote Contests appeared years ago...that drove the market so to speak.
So you enter a BIG MONEY contest 'for the fun'? Well kiss my grits.
One good thing about those MONEY contests...it made the Coyote Hound Hunters hone their skills, because they want to win.
Buckwheat, over the years, I should have a revolving door in the shed because of so many guys stopping in and asking me how do I call Coyotes? They are going to a contest next week. They have a chance to hit the jackpot!
Other Money Contests followed and MONEY is the driving force behind them.
Sponsors  make MONEY and hunters are looking for a BIG PAYDAY.

When fur prices are high, there are record number of predator callers, houndsmen and trappers.
When fur prices are low, not too many guys out there and lots of guys that have excuses not to be out there.
But everyone is in it to have fun.

[Buckwheat]

Hern
I was trying to say much of the same thing.
I know coyote contest are for money and everybody know that, but a lot of that money goes to good causes. So I really gave no feelings one way or the other on them.
 I will say this that during the last lull in fur prices the coyotes spread and got a foot hold in a lot more places really fast. Even with all the current pressure they are still expanding.
During the last lull there were very few callers. This time it will be interesting.
Now there is a whole army of predator callers in PA. This was never the case before.
It will be interesting to see how this calling sport reacts to fur price. They my react the same as trappers.
 Low fur prices and with the coyote here in fair numders already could be the start of coyote explosion everyone fears.

[Misterjake23]

Ernie,

     I think the explosion has already occurred.  Its only going to get worse and most likely out of control.  I've already said that in 5 years, seeing coyotes will be a normal thing like seeing deer/  Especially in urbanized areas where hunting them is almost impossible.

     You know its bad when they are getting hit on the highways now.  Just had one a few months ago hit on Rt 30 at the Wrightsville exit.  And that wasn't the first one....

[Buckwheat]

Misterjake23
I watched the coyotes move in during the last fur price drop.
The thing that might keep it slowed up is redfox and coyotes prices  are still holding up better then the rest of the fur market.

[Leglifter]

I don't think fur prices are responsible for any significant changes in the coyote population.
They are a incredibly resilient animal that only mother nature can control IMO.
Look at the bounties and government projects out west, put in place to eradicate the coyote.
Helicopter shooting, and that bait that exploded poison into the coyotes mouth when they bit it, couldn't even do the trick.
But we do what we can as trappers and callers, to keep the populations in check.

Also, most of the talk of fur prices are just what we tell our wives so they would leave us alone some during the season.
If they think you're making money to cover bills or pay for dinner out by trapping and calling, they're usually on board.   

[Hern]

Buckwheat, The Coyotes are here, been here.
You folks in the southern tier of Pa. have great Red Fox populations.
The Coyote invasion you are fearing has been happening slowly in the southern tier.
Why? Less habitat? Too many Reds (competition)?

I have had reports of pockets of Coyotes in the southern tier.
They may expand from there. Time will tell.
I don't see a sudden appearance or blanketing of Coyote throughout the southern tier. It will take time, as it did in my area.

[Buckwheat]

Leglifter
I only think the part they are resilient is true.
Were they shot off coyotes from the air and poison them it did keep them out of those areas for a wile. But they filtered back in these shot off places when there was nothing to control them from comming back in.
I kind of think of them as cock roaches in a city environment. If the house beside yours has roaches it will not be long until you have them. If you do not spray your house when the first one shows up you will be over run. I happen to think all the hunting and trapping has been slowing therr spread down very good. Not that they have not continued to spread but at a lot slower pace because of trapping and hunting.

[Buckwheat]

Hern
I know coyotes are in pockets in the south east.
But the places they have been were hunting and trapping is allowed they have been killed off or slowed down as they show up.
In areas were you can not trap or shoot them they are still there trying to spead out every year.

[Hern]

Judd Cooney is a top notch outdoorsmen, trapper, predator caller, Deer hunter and guide.
He stated-
A study done a few years back concluded local Coyote population needs reduced by 70% for five consecutive years to make any real dent in the numbers.
More than enough pups are whelped each spring to fill the area's holding capacity.