Fawns in distress???

[skookhunter]

So I was out this morning with my daughter for the mentor youth spring gobbler hunt and we saw some extremely small deer tracks. I didn't think the fawns were born yet. There were spots on the trail where you can see 2 sets of deer tracks heading the same direction, one decent track and a small one about the size of a half dollar max.  If the does had their fawns would now be a good time to hit bush for some yotes and abuse the fawn in distress call?

[Misterjake23]

     Too early for the fawns to be dropping....when they do, I would definitely use a fawn distress and a decoy.  I wouldn'e overcall though.

[Leglifter]

When you do, keep an extra eye out for that mother doe coming to you looking to fight!!

[skookhunter]

We saw 2 yearlings that got spooked by some jakes and we saw those tracks and they were bigger than the small ones we saw. Unless they were malnourished it had to be a fawn. I didn't see any dog tracks though.

[Hern]

From my experience calling Coyote with Fawn Distress, I called in Deer.
I use prey distress and Coyote sounds for Coyote.
Turkey calls for Turkeys.
Duck calls for Ducks.
Not trying to be a smart elick, but just never called in a Coyote using a Deer call. I've tried and tried, but only called Deer.
Years back, I killed a red Coyote, while I was using a Turkey call to call Turkey.
It came in on a rope. I was hunting/calling Turkey, so I didn't do this on purpose or will not rely on Turkey Call for a go-to Coyote getter.

[Hern]

I might add, to try Fawn sound in your area, it may work for you.
I will note, that I found some sounds work well in one part of our state and fall way short in other parts of the state. By that, a fella tells me 'this sounds works best for me' (in his area) and I try it and have poor results. And vise-versa.
Why is that? I found the same true as well in trapping lures and baits.

[Misterjake23]

Hern,

     I couldn't agree with you more.  Thats why many hunter carry a mix bag of calls with them.  I think that the only way to find out is to give it a try.  As its been said many times over, then number one rule to calling in anything is....they have to be there.  I also think that predators are called in due to one of two things...#1 hunger and #2 curisoity.  If you throw a sound out there that makes them curious, they'll respond just to check it out.

     I have a chocolate lab pup.  She won't listen to me when I call her to come.  BUT when I blow a distress call, she comes running in on  a string!!  I believe fox and coyotes react very similarly.   JMO

[Hern]

MJ23, it's not only the sound you are using, it's where you are that's important.
and as you stated, 'they have to be there'.
It's been said many times, but I feel many Coyote callers still don't get it. They don't follow Coyote as the seasons change. True Coyote men follow the change and know Coyote habits. This time of year is their smallest home range, when rearing pups and staying tight to the den site. Calling is good if you know where there are a few dens. Will make you look like a hero. Summer months, Coyotes are sluggish to say the lease. In my area during hot weather they seem to stay in Corn fields and travel very little. So knowing which Corn field they are in ups the odds for a kill. Fall months crops are being taken off and Coyotes are on the move, maybe to a nearby unharvest Corn field or Laurel, Pine, Swamp thicket. Also pups are dispersing at this time. Winter is hit and miss. By that, with extended snow cover, Coyote men know to look on the sunny side of the mountain, large Pine stands and such. Here Coyote are picking off Squirrels, Turkeys and Rabbits where prey find it easier to cope with extended snow cover. If an open winter continues, one must find where the Coyotes are. And all the above adds up to work, not sitting and learning on a computer, but get out there and 'see what you are looking at', put your boots on, work. And many guys don't have the interest or time to learn that, just wanta go out and toot on a call and shoot a Coyote. They may do just that, go out and shoot a Coyote with a e-call or dog squeak toy but have no clue why or how it happened. They try and try the rest of the season with no results. Try two more times next and soon loose interest and fade out of the predator calling community never to be heard from again. Knowing what calls to use for what time of year and what age of Coyote and density of Coyotes all adds up to know how, experience, able to make adjustments, good equipment and using a good curve ball when needed. 

[Leglifter]

Who remembers the old EF Hutton commercials?
Well when Hern talks, people should listen.
I hate to sound like a stalker, but the man is one of the top woodsmen in the state.

[Misterjake23]

+ 1

[Buckwheat]

Hern is the best well rouned hunter I know. I alway listen when he talks.
But here is something to think about.
The fawn distress and the rabbit distress sound almost the same. The only real difference is the cadence.  Now the question is are coyotes, foxes and cats able to tell the difference. I think not. I just think people that blow the rabbit distress call more excited and helps excite critters.

[Hern]

I just think people that blow the rabbit distress call more excited and helps excite critters.
I never worked a fawn sound as hard as I work a Rabbit distress.
Buckwheat, I was always told to use a Rabbit distress with excitement. I show or tell new folks to the game to make it sound like you have a Rabbit by the neck and it can't get away from your grip.
Years back, I would write letters to  Johnny Stewart, Tx., Wiley Carroll, Nv., Paul Falior, Pa., Willis Kent, Wy. (also some Government Predator Control agents I can't remember there names) to ask about pitch, cadence, wait time and such. I recall them telling me to make it sound like it's fighting for it's life (any distress). Yes they used (me too) 45rpm e-caller back then, but they (and me) also used mouth calls.
LegLifter, I wish I was worth as much a E. F. Hutton
The info I posted is common knowledge. But most folks don't know they have that knowledge or how to apply it. Or they are applying it, but don't realize or give thought why they are hunting at this spot.
I read the Pennsylvania Bobcat Survey (radio collard). This study was conducted before 1st PGC Lottery Drawing Bobcat Season. This study was to find out population density, home range, dispersal, travel patterns and such. One thing stood out to me in that survey...Bobcats hunted, lived, traveled on the sunny side of the mountain or ridge. I thought, No kidding? Why didn't they ask a Fox man or Coyote man? Most Canine men know prey live there and predators are there for prey. But that's a documented fact from the raido collar Bobcat Study. And there were a few exceptions to this fact of the study, but the main area was the sunny side.
I used this survey for an example how some folks hunt or give thought to where they hunt.  Now some guys wouldn't think of the sunny side or hunting den sites or hunting standing corn or use these facts to their advantage. And here's a predator hunter that hunted the sunny side with success and is standing tall. Then his buddy says, Grandpa's neighbor hears 'em howling all the time. Let's go get 'em. First, they took someone's word the Coyotes were there, they didn't do any leg work or scouting. Second, it's not the right spot. They failed and the super predator man looks like a joker. Actually the guy is good with the call and a good shot. He fails to think where he had success and when he had success. He fails to think and reason things out. He still kills a few Coyotes now and then, but fails to put 2+2 together to become a top Coyote man.

[Buckwheat]

Hern
I know that is what is even said how to make the sound today for rabbit and that is pretty much correct. But the sounds for fawn distress is only believed  to be done only one way and i think is incorrect.  On my call sounds last breath death cry is just one of the fawn type sounds I have used and worked. I just think the fawn distress can sound a lot like a rabbit.
 As you know I have  alot of the recorded sounds from the past made.on 33 1/3 and 45 record's. I even have there calling training instructions on these old records.

If you blow the fawn distress or the rabbit distress in a thick area were there are fawns you will call in doe that have young very quickly.  In real life fawns can get very vocal when needed. I use to record fawns that were injured from cars. I seen them scream so loud and violently that people came out of there house to see what all the noise was about.
The way people have been trained to make the fawn distress  is from people that record sounds of the fawn distress that were slower and softer then a rabbit. But the truth is fawns can get pretty excited and loud.
 Deer and rabbits can be Just like crow's, when it comes to dieing,   some make a lot of sound when shot and others hardly make a peep.
So I can say anything that is high pitched and makes a desperate sound will work. I do not think deer or coyotes can tell the difference. Excitement is the key.

[Hern]

Bw says-
So I can say anything that is high pitched and makes a desperate sound will work. I do not think deer or coyotes can tell the difference.
I like the way you think, Buckwheat. I agree.
Much the same thinking why Coyotes howl at the noon whistle or ambulance siren. Dad raised Beagles. His Beagles would howl at the Noon whistle each day. I've heard Coyotes howl at siren from responding ambulance and heard Coyotes howl when I used a siren to make 'em howl for locating purpose. Siren seems so unnatural in the Coyote vocals or Coyote world. But the pitch provokes a natural response, if that makes any sense. Having said that, perhaps we predator callers (I'll use myself as and example) think that blowing on a Rabbit distress is more effective than tooting on a Woodpecker distress (or Fawn distress). But using either with the same zip and zeal, am getting the same pitch, using the same cadence and getting the same kills. But we still think one call in better than the other. It's the pitch and how we go about using the mouth call. I understand what you are saying Buckwheat. Otay.     

[Buckwheat]

Hern
I use to love it when people would purchase my calls and say the critters came running on the first couple of times out and now nothing?  They would then ask me what they were now doing wrong. I would just tell them it was because they went to the best spots first and had good success.  What they were doing wrong after that was calling were there was nothing to call in. Scouting it the key to every type of hunt not just predators. There is no substitute for hard work and scouting to find a target rich environment and an excited sounding mouth call.